logo
Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

3 Pages123>
Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
Offline ALX  
#1 Posted : 11 May 2010 09:23:57(UTC)
ALX
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 19/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 753
Man
Location: STALKER!

Just list a stereotype that your country/culture has about another country/culture.

for example:

American pop culture tends to make British people scone eating-cricket playing-soccer (football) watching-cultured-charming snobs.

Once again, just an example of a stereotype
RP Only Since July 2010

The Owner Of:

Long Nights- [alt-rock/post-grunge- think Foo Fighters meets Creature with the Atom Brain] MTN Climber
-Ryan Page: Vocals/Guitar/Keys
-Warren Mcgriff- Guitar
-Christopher I. Myers- Bass
-Blake Renwick- Drums

The World According To St. Jimmy- [Pop-punk/punk- Think Green Day meets Social Distortion]
-Michael "Dog" Bryant: Vocals
-Shawn "Shady" Harris: Guitar
-Jeff Zamora: Bass
-Karl Hine: Drums

forkboy wrote:
STOP MISSING THE FUCKING POINT YOU INTENTIONALLY OBTUSE BUFFOON


Paradox wrote:
*Shotgun clicks*

Dont mess with prog

The Skulls wrote:
Why thank you. Wait, if I'm alive then -- oh lawdy BRRRAAAAIIINZZZ

Offline C4AJoh  
#2 Posted : 11 May 2010 09:27:10(UTC)
C4AJoh
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Moderators, Registered
Joined: 18/05/2009(UTC)
Posts: 13,440
Man
United Kingdom

Thanks: 4248 times
Was thanked: 8716 time(s) in 2740 post(s)
ALX wrote:
Just list a stereotype that your country/culture has about another country/culture.

for example:

American pop culture tends to make British people scone eating-cricket playing-soccer (football) watching-cultured-charming snobs.

Once again, just an example of a stereotype


Before i read your example of what an American thinks of British people i was about to put pretty much the same sentance.

I'm british but certainly on TV thats what americans think of us.
Offline ALX  
#3 Posted : 11 May 2010 09:32:07(UTC)
ALX
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 19/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 753
Man
Location: STALKER!

C4AJoh wrote:
ALX wrote:
Just list a stereotype that your country/culture has about another country/culture.

for example:

American pop culture tends to make British people scone eating-cricket playing-soccer (football) watching-cultured-charming snobs.

Once again, just an example of a stereotype


Before i read your example of what an American thinks of British people i was about to put pretty much the same sentance.

I'm british but certainly on TV thats what americans think of us.

Exactly, that's what the thread was about, doing away with the stereotypes within the RSG communtiy
RP Only Since July 2010

The Owner Of:

Long Nights- [alt-rock/post-grunge- think Foo Fighters meets Creature with the Atom Brain] MTN Climber
-Ryan Page: Vocals/Guitar/Keys
-Warren Mcgriff- Guitar
-Christopher I. Myers- Bass
-Blake Renwick- Drums

The World According To St. Jimmy- [Pop-punk/punk- Think Green Day meets Social Distortion]
-Michael "Dog" Bryant: Vocals
-Shawn "Shady" Harris: Guitar
-Jeff Zamora: Bass
-Karl Hine: Drums

forkboy wrote:
STOP MISSING THE FUCKING POINT YOU INTENTIONALLY OBTUSE BUFFOON


Paradox wrote:
*Shotgun clicks*

Dont mess with prog

The Skulls wrote:
Why thank you. Wait, if I'm alive then -- oh lawdy BRRRAAAAIIINZZZ

Offline C4AJoh  
#4 Posted : 11 May 2010 09:33:35(UTC)
C4AJoh
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Moderators, Registered
Joined: 18/05/2009(UTC)
Posts: 13,440
Man
United Kingdom

Thanks: 4248 times
Was thanked: 8716 time(s) in 2740 post(s)
I think british opinion of americans is that americans always go bigger and better, kind of that their very grandiose.
I don't know if you'd agree with that but thats the opinion a lot my friends have of America.
Offline old.gregg  
#5 Posted : 11 May 2010 09:42:38(UTC)
old.gregg
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Moderators, Registered
Joined: 11/02/2009(UTC)
Posts: 2,308
Man

Thanks: 3 times
Was thanked: 14 time(s) in 6 post(s)
I'd post something meaningful, but I'm knackered from cricket earlier, and just chilling out in front of some good old football with a scone and a cuppa tea.
-
Offline Rincewind  
#6 Posted : 11 May 2010 09:44:08(UTC)
Rincewind
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Moderators, Registered
Joined: 10/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,995
Man
Location: i honestly don't know.

Thanks: 20 times
Was thanked: 124 time(s) in 87 post(s)
god i do love tea.
I hate it when people see me at the supermarket and they are like:
Hey, what are you doing here?
and im just like:
Oh you know, hunting elephants
Offline ALX  
#7 Posted : 11 May 2010 09:45:46(UTC)
ALX
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 19/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 753
Man
Location: STALKER!

Rincewind wrote:
god i do love tea.

same...
RP Only Since July 2010

The Owner Of:

Long Nights- [alt-rock/post-grunge- think Foo Fighters meets Creature with the Atom Brain] MTN Climber
-Ryan Page: Vocals/Guitar/Keys
-Warren Mcgriff- Guitar
-Christopher I. Myers- Bass
-Blake Renwick- Drums

The World According To St. Jimmy- [Pop-punk/punk- Think Green Day meets Social Distortion]
-Michael "Dog" Bryant: Vocals
-Shawn "Shady" Harris: Guitar
-Jeff Zamora: Bass
-Karl Hine: Drums

forkboy wrote:
STOP MISSING THE FUCKING POINT YOU INTENTIONALLY OBTUSE BUFFOON


Paradox wrote:
*Shotgun clicks*

Dont mess with prog

The Skulls wrote:
Why thank you. Wait, if I'm alive then -- oh lawdy BRRRAAAAIIINZZZ

Offline forkboy  
#8 Posted : 11 May 2010 10:51:35(UTC)
forkboy
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 05/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 3,255
Location: Glasgow

Thanks: 34 times
Was thanked: 107 time(s) in 82 post(s)
C4AJoh wrote:
I think british opinion of americans is that americans always go bigger and better, kind of that their very grandiose.
I don't know if you'd agree with that but thats the opinion a lot my friends have of America.

Grandiose is not ever a word I'd use to describe Americans. Too intellectual.

My own stereotype of Americans, which I am well aware to be nonsense for large numbers of people, is naive, easily led idiots who like guns and eat fast food two or three times a day and actually beleive what they see on TV. I also would say that they are overly patriotic and with that, quite defensive; Americans don't like you saying bad things about America. Oh, and stupid. The stereotypical Yank is so fucking thick that they are the sort of person who things Fox News really is Fair and Balanced, that Obama is a socialist (lol, Marx is pissing himself in his grave at that particular comment) and that Sarah Palin is a viable candidate to run an entire nation, never mind a crappy state with about 10 inuits and some polar bears.

Of course, that's more of a stereotype of a particular kind of American but that is probably my over stereotype of Americans as a whole.
Offline The Nimrods  
#9 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:12:03(UTC)
The Nimrods
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 19/02/2009(UTC)
Posts: 3,717
Location: home

Thanks: 3 times
Was thanked: 59 time(s) in 36 post(s)
To be completely honest I'm offended. That's Rednecks not Americans in general, I'm defensive of this but the other traits don't apply to me and only a small amount of those traits apply to Americans in general.
The Nimrods (Progressive Death Metal,Progressive Metal,Progressive Rock.Think Opeth/Dream Theater/Tool/Pink Floyd)
Jimmy Him- Lead Guitar,Vocals,Primary Songwriter
Davey Matlock- Bass,Guitars,Vocals,Primary Songwriter
Kit Saunders- Drums,additional percussion
Jaska Latvala- Rhythm Guitar,Vocals,Primary Songwriter
Jack Burton- Keyboards,Keytar

Satyr in the Frost(Melodic Black Metal,think Satyricon/Mayhem/Early Dimmu Borgir/Immortal)
Sigmund-Vocals and Rhythm guitar
Celt-Drums
Saxon-Lead Guitar
Sauron-Keyboard
Gris-Bass
Rincewind wrote:
The Nimrods wrote:
I knew you'd be back! *cries*


now now, *hugs and steals wallet*

xNightsidex wrote:
Oops I stumbled over and hit the "extend ban" button.

UserPostedImage

Gildermershina wrote:
The Nimrods wrote:
xNightsidex wrote:
Sooo...

What's everyone else do in the real world?


Sell pot and jerk off

JK, or am i?


At the same time?


Rincewind wrote:
Synxhard wrote:
I don't believe in jeans...


well your shit out of luck because they believe in you.....

Offline The Nimrods  
#10 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:14:29(UTC)
The Nimrods
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 19/02/2009(UTC)
Posts: 3,717
Location: home

Thanks: 3 times
Was thanked: 59 time(s) in 36 post(s)
By the way while the Fox thing is pretty widely believed only Right-Wing retards think Obama is a socialist and even Palin's 1 year old with Down Syndrome knows she isn't capable of doing anything above the difficulty of being a hockey mom.
The Nimrods (Progressive Death Metal,Progressive Metal,Progressive Rock.Think Opeth/Dream Theater/Tool/Pink Floyd)
Jimmy Him- Lead Guitar,Vocals,Primary Songwriter
Davey Matlock- Bass,Guitars,Vocals,Primary Songwriter
Kit Saunders- Drums,additional percussion
Jaska Latvala- Rhythm Guitar,Vocals,Primary Songwriter
Jack Burton- Keyboards,Keytar

Satyr in the Frost(Melodic Black Metal,think Satyricon/Mayhem/Early Dimmu Borgir/Immortal)
Sigmund-Vocals and Rhythm guitar
Celt-Drums
Saxon-Lead Guitar
Sauron-Keyboard
Gris-Bass
Rincewind wrote:
The Nimrods wrote:
I knew you'd be back! *cries*


now now, *hugs and steals wallet*

xNightsidex wrote:
Oops I stumbled over and hit the "extend ban" button.

UserPostedImage

Gildermershina wrote:
The Nimrods wrote:
xNightsidex wrote:
Sooo...

What's everyone else do in the real world?


Sell pot and jerk off

JK, or am i?


At the same time?


Rincewind wrote:
Synxhard wrote:
I don't believe in jeans...


well your shit out of luck because they believe in you.....

Offline Paradox  
#11 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:22:34(UTC)
Paradox
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 08/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,007
Man
Location: cuernavaca, mexico

Why would you do a thread like this? To get everyone throwing shit at each other? Again? Or to get asdf to mention "the club"? Yet again?
RP bands:
Insolent Paradox - Progressive [Forum Thread] - Post-production
Oceans - Fusion Jazz - Writing

stephaniewazhere wrote:
I'm failing? I'm failing??????? LMAO!!!!!!



Mod Edit - you failed...


Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room.
Offline The Nimrods  
#12 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:24:23(UTC)
The Nimrods
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 19/02/2009(UTC)
Posts: 3,717
Location: home

Thanks: 3 times
Was thanked: 59 time(s) in 36 post(s)
Paradox wrote:
Why would you do a thread like this? To get everyone throwing shit at each other? Again? Or to get asdf to mention "the club"? Yet again?


That's what I'm thinking ,this is essentially a hate thread, people throwing stereotypes against other countries? Pretty bad idea.
The Nimrods (Progressive Death Metal,Progressive Metal,Progressive Rock.Think Opeth/Dream Theater/Tool/Pink Floyd)
Jimmy Him- Lead Guitar,Vocals,Primary Songwriter
Davey Matlock- Bass,Guitars,Vocals,Primary Songwriter
Kit Saunders- Drums,additional percussion
Jaska Latvala- Rhythm Guitar,Vocals,Primary Songwriter
Jack Burton- Keyboards,Keytar

Satyr in the Frost(Melodic Black Metal,think Satyricon/Mayhem/Early Dimmu Borgir/Immortal)
Sigmund-Vocals and Rhythm guitar
Celt-Drums
Saxon-Lead Guitar
Sauron-Keyboard
Gris-Bass
Rincewind wrote:
The Nimrods wrote:
I knew you'd be back! *cries*


now now, *hugs and steals wallet*

xNightsidex wrote:
Oops I stumbled over and hit the "extend ban" button.

UserPostedImage

Gildermershina wrote:
The Nimrods wrote:
xNightsidex wrote:
Sooo...

What's everyone else do in the real world?


Sell pot and jerk off

JK, or am i?


At the same time?


Rincewind wrote:
Synxhard wrote:
I don't believe in jeans...


well your shit out of luck because they believe in you.....

Offline forkboy  
#13 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:25:44(UTC)
forkboy
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 05/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 3,255
Location: Glasgow

Thanks: 34 times
Was thanked: 107 time(s) in 82 post(s)
The Nimrods wrote:
To be completely honest I'm offended. That's Rednecks not Americans in general, I'm defensive of this but the other traits don't apply to me and only a small amount of those traits apply to Americans in general.

Well, stereotypes are never meant to be flattering!

Yes, I'm well aware that my basic image of "an American" is that of someone from the Bible Belt, gun-toting, staunch Republican. Not neccessarily a redneck though, more a teabagger.

I'm perfectly aware in rational thought of people in Americas history such as Thomas Jefferson who I think was a great man, or someone like Benjamin Tucker, or even in more recent times there are plenty of admirable American intellectuals, such as Noam Chomsky or PZ Myers. But stereotypes aren't really about being rational, they are your gut instinct, the first thing that comes into your head when you think of a race or nationality, and usually it's not exactly pretty, see the "French only know how to surrender" nonsense, or "the English excel at nothing except for football hooliganism" or "the Scots are all fun drunks with ginger hair who wear kilts and stab each other with knives" :p

Oh, that was one thing I forgot to mention, the stereotype American to me is also anti-intellectual. I've never really understood that gut distrust of people with a university education that certain sectors (the people who are attracted to Palin) seem to have. It obviously exists in every other country, but it is certainly alot less prominent here than in America.
The Nimrods wrote:
That's what I'm thinking ,this is essentially a hate thread, people throwing stereotypes against other countries? Pretty bad idea.

You just have to take stereotypes to the absurd conclusion for everyone. I'm as happy poking fun at the stereotype for my own nation (Scotland) or even my own race (being that I am a white northern European I think you could bring something out about being a self-righteous prick who thinks every other culture is wrong and that I need to spread imperialism to "educate" those from elsewhere in the world".

Edited by user 11 May 2010 11:28:03(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline ALX  
#14 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:27:45(UTC)
ALX
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 19/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 753
Man
Location: STALKER!

forkboy wrote:
C4AJoh wrote:
I think british opinion of americans is that americans always go bigger and better, kind of that their very grandiose.
I don't know if you'd agree with that but thats the opinion a lot my friends have of America.

Grandiose is not ever a word I'd use to describe Americans. Too intellectual.

My own stereotype of Americans, which I am well aware to be nonsense for large numbers of people, is naive, easily led idiots who like guns and eat fast food two or three times a day and actually beleive what they see on TV. I also would say that they are overly patriotic and with that, quite defensive; Americans don't like you saying bad things about America. Oh, and stupid. The stereotypical Yank is so fucking thick that they are the sort of person who things Fox News really is Fair and Balanced, that Obama is a socialist (lol, Marx is pissing himself in his grave at that particular comment) and that Sarah Palin is a viable candidate to run an entire nation, never mind a crappy state with about 10 inuits and some polar bears.

Of course, that's more of a stereotype of a particular kind of American but that is probably my over stereotype of Americans as a whole.

[yay, rebuttal time]

What you have decribed here is essentially a very right-wing and conservative republican. Us liberal democrats DON'T think Obama's socialist, DON'T think Fox News is fair and balanced, and DON'T think Sarah Palin is a "viable candidate to run an entire nation".

Also, she was running for vice-president along with John McCain, and the president and vice-president they choose are a package deal.
RP Only Since July 2010

The Owner Of:

Long Nights- [alt-rock/post-grunge- think Foo Fighters meets Creature with the Atom Brain] MTN Climber
-Ryan Page: Vocals/Guitar/Keys
-Warren Mcgriff- Guitar
-Christopher I. Myers- Bass
-Blake Renwick- Drums

The World According To St. Jimmy- [Pop-punk/punk- Think Green Day meets Social Distortion]
-Michael "Dog" Bryant: Vocals
-Shawn "Shady" Harris: Guitar
-Jeff Zamora: Bass
-Karl Hine: Drums

forkboy wrote:
STOP MISSING THE FUCKING POINT YOU INTENTIONALLY OBTUSE BUFFOON


Paradox wrote:
*Shotgun clicks*

Dont mess with prog

The Skulls wrote:
Why thank you. Wait, if I'm alive then -- oh lawdy BRRRAAAAIIINZZZ

Offline forkboy  
#15 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:29:40(UTC)
forkboy
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 05/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 3,255
Location: Glasgow

Thanks: 34 times
Was thanked: 107 time(s) in 82 post(s)
ALX wrote:

[yay, rebuttal time]

What you have decribed here is essentially a very right-wing and conservative republican. Us liberal democrats DON'T think Obama's socialist, DON'T think Fox News is fair and balanced, and DON'T think Sarah Palin is a "viable candidate to run an entire nation".

Also, she was running for vice-president along with John McCain, and the president and vice-president they choose are a package deal.

Ugh. You've seemingly missed the point in your own thread so bravo. STEREOTYPES ARE NOT REALITY. They should not be confused with reality. They are, at best, a parody of reality.

I am perfectly aware of what I said and that it is nonsense. That's surely the point of this thread?

As for your last line. Man. I am aware. I pay attention to American politics enough to know who the freaking vice presidential candidates are, it's impossible NOT to know if you turn into a UK news broadcast. I was more referring to the possibility of a presidential bid being made in 2012. I've even, rather hysterically, heard about it being touted as a Palin/Beck "dream" (nightmare) ticket, though I think Glenn Beck as a good Mormon wasn't keen on being below a woman on the ticket.

The Tea Party have gained an enormous influence on the lunatic fringe of the Republican Party, I'd not be shocked if she was on the ticket one way or another.

Edited by user 11 May 2010 11:40:01(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline forkboy  
#16 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:35:09(UTC)
forkboy
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 05/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 3,255
Location: Glasgow

Thanks: 34 times
Was thanked: 107 time(s) in 82 post(s)
ALX wrote:
Just list a stereotype that your country/culture has about another country/culture.

for example:

American pop culture tends to make British people scone eating-cricket playing-soccer (football) watching-cultured-charming snobs.

Once again, just an example of a stereotype

If we're going to totally miss the point and just be totally patronising to each other though, fuck, don't expect me to miss out on a chance to patronise.

Cricket is played almost exclusively by the English. In fact every stereotype you have associated with the "British" is an English stereotype as opposed to a British one because really, there is no singular British identity really, or at least not in my eyes as someone who is British. Generally football is a sport that is enjoyed by the working classes who are anything but cultured snobs, hence why going to the football can be such a gloriously crude experience with some of the first class tasteless chants that are sung.
Offline Synxhard  
#17 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:36:42(UTC)
Synxhard
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 03/04/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,433
Man
Location: Seattle

Thanks: 22 times
Was thanked: 33 time(s) in 16 post(s)
forkboy wrote:
C4AJoh wrote:
I think british opinion of americans is that americans always go bigger and better, kind of that their very grandiose.
I don't know if you'd agree with that but thats the opinion a lot my friends have of America.

Grandiose is not ever a word I'd use to describe Americans. Too intellectual.

My own stereotype of Americans, which I am well aware to be nonsense for large numbers of people, is naive, easily led idiots who like guns and eat fast food two or three times a day and actually beleive what they see on TV. I also would say that they are overly patriotic and with that, quite defensive; Americans don't like you saying bad things about America. Oh, and stupid. The stereotypical Yank is so fucking thick that they are the sort of person who things Fox News really is Fair and Balanced, that Obama is a socialist (lol, Marx is pissing himself in his grave at that particular comment) and that Sarah Palin is a viable candidate to run an entire nation, never mind a crappy state with about 10 inuits and some polar bears.

Of course, that's more of a stereotype of a particular kind of American but that is probably my over stereotype of Americans as a whole.


I actually find this kind of amusing. I'm sure I'd probably think the same way if I wasn't American, which is what kinda scares me....
Offline asdf  
#18 Posted : 11 May 2010 12:02:44(UTC)
asdf
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Moderators, Registered
Joined: 11/02/2009(UTC)
Posts: 3,340
Man
Location: Narsik

Thanks: 295 times
Was thanked: 539 time(s) in 290 post(s)
I think British people and most of the world think we are all dumb fat lazy people, when obviously thats only 70% of us.
Proud member since September 6th, 2007!

Proud to be a mod since May 5th, 2011!

Currently writing the longest Solo-Written RP in Rockstar Game History
Offline ALX  
#19 Posted : 11 May 2010 12:13:28(UTC)
ALX
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 19/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 753
Man
Location: STALKER!

:'-( Why is it anytime I start a topic with good intentions, it goes terribly, terribly wrong.
RP Only Since July 2010

The Owner Of:

Long Nights- [alt-rock/post-grunge- think Foo Fighters meets Creature with the Atom Brain] MTN Climber
-Ryan Page: Vocals/Guitar/Keys
-Warren Mcgriff- Guitar
-Christopher I. Myers- Bass
-Blake Renwick- Drums

The World According To St. Jimmy- [Pop-punk/punk- Think Green Day meets Social Distortion]
-Michael "Dog" Bryant: Vocals
-Shawn "Shady" Harris: Guitar
-Jeff Zamora: Bass
-Karl Hine: Drums

forkboy wrote:
STOP MISSING THE FUCKING POINT YOU INTENTIONALLY OBTUSE BUFFOON


Paradox wrote:
*Shotgun clicks*

Dont mess with prog

The Skulls wrote:
Why thank you. Wait, if I'm alive then -- oh lawdy BRRRAAAAIIINZZZ

Offline chopper1156  
#20 Posted : 11 May 2010 12:19:51(UTC)
chopper1156
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 06/05/2010(UTC)
Posts: 804
Man
Location: Why do you wanna know?

asdf wrote:
I think British people and most of the world think we are all dumb fat lazy people, when obviously thats only 70% of us.


LOL
Old Successes

The Rebels
Iron Hammer
Till Death Do Us Part

Now-Act Of God-New Wave of American Heavy Metal/Nu-Metal

Sounds like-Slipknot, Avenged Sevenfold, Stone Sour, Godsmack, Black Label Society, Black Sabbath, and Ozzy.

Signed to-Monk on Fire Music

Jason Wilson
Connor McWilliams
Geo
Sebastian
Alex Walkman

Nominated for Best Band at the 21st IMAS/Birdies
Users browsing this topic
Guest (6)
3 Pages123>
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Powered by YAF.NET | YAF.NET © 2003-2024, Yet Another Forum.NET
This page was generated in 0.317 seconds.