From your perspective maybe. Hardly from theirs. Why should they care about anything more than the wellbeing of their family? That's clearly what matters in life.

And as I've said before, just because something is a law doesn't make it right or just or moral or anything like that. To take a completely extreme point, Germany in 1936 and it's anti-Jew laws. They were the law. But I like to think I'd have done the upmost I can to help any Jewish friends to escape the persecution of Kristallnacht.

Well US is build over the skeletons of mexican and indian people, anyway no one wants to go over a revolution again, Mexico is somehow scarred for the 68 massacre (the government killed many people wanna know why? because the Mexico 68 Olympics were coming) and the revolution at beginning of the past century, plus the way elections go here you hve to choose what is called the less worst candidate, there is 2 capitalist ultra conservative parties and then there is a so-called leftist party run by monkeys so how to get the country out of the hole?

"A Monument to Stupidity" is exactly how I would have worded it. If you can barely support you and you wife, then maybe you shouldnt have sex every night of the week cause yea you might still be poor, but then you wouldnt have to worry about the children that you just unfairly brought into a unstable home. Plus it would make Stephs argument of "Wont anyone please think of the Children?" be non-existent.

What about over population I think some countries like Cuba that has an incredible medical system yet somehow its a third world country a family with 5 kids will have 1 employed son/daughter and 4 unemployed, alcoholic homeless kids on the future

You can't tell somebody not to have kids. Who doesn't have sex. Sex is the best way to releases stress and I'm pretty sure they don't have sex every night. Now I don't know if its cuz they can't afford condoms but like I said before its part of their culture to have kids. And yes some of them can't, because if they can't buy a single pound of bread how can they afford condoms.

We are hugely over populated, it will be a while before we dont have enough workers.


6,706,993,152 people in the world and by 2020 we will have
8,000,000,000

at this rate also, did you know Mexico is the 11th most populated country in the world? United states is third.

There are 306,969,574 people in the USA and
11,000,000 are ILLEGAL imigrants.

I didnt say "Make them not have sex" I am saying that they are causing there own problems by doing so wheather its good and releases stress or not. It make release stress while its happening but 9 months from now, you will have more stress than ever. Its common sense. Like chocolate, good now, makes you fat later.

This discussion isn't just about America though. Illegal immigration affects many nations. I mean the thread was started by a Brit, and Paul was referencing a British problem, as our population IS currently falling. Especially in Scotland.

And your numbers are interesting.

Primarily because they state that using those figures (and it has to be pointed out that it's almost impossible to know the number of illegals because they are obviously impossible to keep track of, the number could be between 5 million and 18 million depending on your source) just over 3% of the US population is illegal immigrants. It's barely a blip on the radar.

Also, putting world population figures into the discussion have no relevance to what Paul was talking about. He was refering to the situation in First World countries.

No its not...We closed the doors for a reason, there are too many people here, we cant hold any more. If this keeps going we will be standing shoulder to shoulder all around the USA! I know I am contradicting myself but, realy just because your in poverty you dont go around breaking laws to make life better. The USA has many of its own citizens who are in poverty but they arent breaking into Canada!

11 million is the figure from the USA government and while not much, it is when you consider the country is over populated with out the illegals.

TO Steph, true but before that you got 10 freaking years of having to struggle to support 3 people instead of 2 or 1. True also that they would still be poor but if you have 10 dollars (just a random figure) it is easier to get 2 people a meal on the 10 bucks than to have to pay for 3 or 4 or 5 or even 6!

$10 goes further for 2 than it does for 3...